9800 Gx2

[jsimo01]

Hello,


I am thinking of building a new system and it has been some time since I have done this and would like to ask if anyone has experience with these cards? In particular relating to their size and some of the advanced features they are sporting!

My Proposed Set-up:-

GPU: ASUS EN9800GX2/G/2DI/1G/A OR 1GB XFX 9800GX2, Black Edition
MOBO: ASUS Maximus Formula (OR P5N64 WS Pro OR Striker II Extreme)
CPU: Q6700 or Q9450 (depending on what money is left)
RAM: DDR2 At Least 4GB (DDR3 2GB to start with)
OS: WinXP to start (Vista Ultimate eventually)

Questions:

1. Do they take up any additional PCI slots? ( I would like at least 2 Free if possible)
2. I believe you can pair these with a nVidia board or something (Hybrid Power?) I am presuming this means the SLi chipset? If so does anyone know which ones are compatible Please?

I am trying to be more flexible with the board but have a preference for ASUS, but leaing towards XFX as I've heard only good things so far, but I am open to any advice you may have to offer.

Thanking you in advance.

John

[Radiator]

Well , they have dual slot coolers... but the card itself uses a single PCI-e slot .
And two of these cards means quad-SLi which is rather buggy and doesn't work on most applications , as far as I know .

[Die Auslese]

I own a GX2, and I must tell you its a nice card, but to honest i would'nt buy anthor 2-GPU card, theres alot of complications with a 2-GPU card. It Takes up roughly 13 inches of room in my PC, which is about 2 inches to the max. I got my CPU, and MOBO combo for about $250, the reason the MOBo is some no name brand, with 1 PCI-E slot, and a 1066MB FSB, and supports at best 800mhz RAM. I got the GX2 becuase at the time it was the most powerful, and i was looking for an upgrade from my 2 GTS 320's (and my AMD FX-55). Being the geek I'am i bought the cheapest one I could find, got a waterblcok and overclocked the hell out of it. I'm impressed with the card, but i don't like how slow it runs on Non-SLI supporting games, its only using half the card and half the PCI-E slot, but when i have a game with SLI support its amazing how much this one card can churn out. Anything else?

[jsimo01]

Thanks very much,

I was not thinking about a pair, but the feature mentioned I believe switches between the on-board graphics (if present) and the GPU to reduce power consumption on non-intensive programs.

In terms of brands what would you recommend? XFX appear to be quite good but I have not heard of PNY and do not know how their cards fare compared to others.

Thanks again,

John

[Headfoot]

If you are planning on getting an SLI mobo, and you dont want 3-way SLI your only real choice is the nForce 750i chipset. The nForce 750i chipset is a real champ from what I hear. If you do want 3 way SLI do not get nForce 780i, get 790i. I hear there are issues with 780.

nForce 790 will support DDR3, although overclocked DDR2 is equally as fast at this point in time. It is a more economical choice to go with 750i and and fast DDR2 than to go with 790i and DDR3. 790i and DDR3 are only going to be marginally, if any, faster for much more money.

I have heard tons and tons of good thing about EVGA's nForce 750i SLI FTW motherboard. It has no onboard video, so no Hybrid Power, but its a great otherwise. It supports DDR2 1066 and 1333 by way of Overclocking.

As for your video card, EVGA is the only company to realize that their worth has diminished since the advent of the new Radeons. Here's one on NewEgg thats significantly cheaper than all the others. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130338


Also in case brand loyalty factors into your decision, getting two 4850's in Crossfire trades blows with the GX2 (depending on which game you are playing), and two 4870's solidly beats the GX2.:D

[jsimo01]

Thanks Headfoot,

I had just been scouting round the forums and were thinking of looking at the dual 4870 route, Its being discussed on another thread at the moment.

My present card is an ATi, with regards brand loyalty it's really just a preference I have had to ASUS boards as they've always proven more reliable in the past though my present board is from MSI .

I have also been looking at the GTX280, first just on its own but later adding a second in SLi, do you think this (on its own) would fair well against dual 4870's?

[Radiator]

Two HD 4870s will outperform it where CF properly works... however , in my opinion the GTX280 is a waste of money .
I'd get the HD 4870 , because it's a hell of a lot cheaper , and not THAT much slower than a GTX280 .

[hdantman]

The P5E3 from ASUS (x48) is an incredible overclocker. I had that board before I got my 790i. I'm surprised at the video card choice also, but some people have had a good experience with it. The 790i is wonderful--3-way SLI or not. I'm not using 3-way, and I'm still blown away by it. I think that mobo choice is the single most important choice in any system, so it's best to go all out there, rather than anywhere else. The benefit to the p5e3 is also the built in wifi ap, if you get the deluxe version (which I had). VERY good board. Has a NEATO feature to called Express Gate. I too love ASUS mobos, but go all out. It's worth it to cut back on your dual vid cards to get a better board.

Either the 790i or the P5E3 are the best of the best. You will be blown away by either. I'd go back and buy another p5e3 if I knew my 3870 x2 was the bad egg in my system, but I digress...

The x48 chipsets are known for issues with the 9800X2, so buy at your own risk. I'd seriously consider just buying the P5E3 with a single 4870 or GTX280 if you want top of the line. The upside to a single 4870 is xfire option for later on with the P5E3.

If you're going to go the dual nVidia route, stick to the 790i.

The 9450 will rock the house over the 6700, given a great overclocking mobo like the two I've mentioned. I've pushed a 9300 to over 3.75 stable on both mobos, with the RAM being the only limiting factor in my system. That's both boards that are capable. If you plan on OCing, or want the most out of your budget 45nm quad, you NEEEEEEED FSB 2000, and I'm not kidding. Low multi necesitates a board to make up the slack.

[jsimo01]

Thanks Guys,

I think the dual HD4870 route is the best choice, they look brilliant cards!

Hdantman: Thanks for your advice, the Q9450 has been my first choice, however just needed to nail down the GPU options; it's been 7 years since I've built a PC and I want to get it right.

On the issue of board choice I have been going backwards and forwards on this all week, I will confess to overlooking the P5E3 (although the X38 version was top of my list back in Feb. when I first started contemplating a self build). I have narrowed it down to Maximus Extreme (X38) & Rampage Formula (X48), there seems to be little difference between the two performance wise at stock values and the P5E3 Deluxe (X48), I'm presuming that the performance gain is more for the X48 when OC'd?

[hdantman]

I'm glad to help--I'm a nerd at heart. My recommendation of the p5e3 comes because of your processor choices. The 9450 has a locked multiplier of 8, thus limiting you to 3.2Ghz at FSB 1600, which you'd have to run at 5:4 with EXCELLENT DDR2 RAM in order to get the most out of it. You'll realistically have to run at 3:2 or unlink in order to pull FSB 1600 off due to DDR2 limitations, unless you literally buy the best DDR2 money can buy, which then begs the question: why buy a DDR2 board when DDR3 is the current generation, and costs less for better performance?

Don't get me wrong--both boards you picked were up high on my list when I was considering my new build, but I opted for DDR3 because of the low multi on my CPU. That's the benefit to blowing lots of money on a high-end processor--you have more freedom there. That's why Intel locks the multi so low on their budget CPUs--otherwise, no one in the world would buy the high-end ones, because there would be no difference. They know that the average consumer does not have a mobo capable of pulling the high FSB speeds required to get top-end performance out of their budget 45nm chips. You have the same dilemma I did--DDR2/DDR3? Top of the line mobo, or high end CPU? In a perfect world, Intel would just ship the 9300s and 9450s with unlocked multis :D but we both know that wouldn't happen. Heavens, it would be like nVidia shipping a budget sub-$200 GPU with performance on par with their 8800 Ultra line ;) . Oh wait...

I'm tellin' you--go all out on the mobo--it's the one component you don't want to end up replacing in a year.

Also, most DDR3 that states it is only capable of 2T command rate can easily pull of 1T if the timings are SLIGHTLY loosened. Because hardware noobs don't know any better, they think timing/latency and clock speed are the only factors in RAM performance.

P5E3 with 1333 DDR3--perfect price point on the RAM (outperforms DDR2 for lower price at that speed), and will OC the living hell out of your 9450. I'm running 3.6 on my 9300 right now, FSB 1920, and the benchmark difference between that and 3.175 is 4811 to 2905. I can feel the difference in 64bit Vista, as it shaves 4 full seconds off my boot time. Both of these are running DDR3 at 1333.3, 9-9-9-27 1T, 1.7V.

Whatever you choose, you'll be happy with. Stock on the 9300 is 2.5Ghz, and even at 3.2Ghz that's a 28% OC, with massive performance gains across the board. If you get an FSB 2000 capable board, you'll be able to push a 44% OC, which is ridiculous, and wonderful and the same time, thanks to that lovely 45nm process.

[hdantman]

Sorry--I didn't answer your question fully:

x38 has issues with some intel 9xxx series processors--this has been fixed with x48.

x48 supports DDR3 and higher FSB speeds.

Basically, you might get lucky and get a top performing x38, but depending on the manufacturing time, you might get a board that performs less than what you should expect at that price point.

x48 will be a winner, no doubt. I've owned two x48s and one x38. Both x48s blew my mind when it came to OCing. The x38 was capable of its rated specs, but couldn't push much higher.

Simply put: the x48 is a better overclocker, and with the 9450, that is what I would want. Bear in mind that I currently own a 790i, and love it to death. It's just not what I'd recommend for a crossfire build.

[Headfoot]

2 4870's is fine if you prefer ATI, 1 GTX 280 is fine if you prefer nVidia (or plan on SLI'ing later). They perform more or less equally.

hdantman has the details; it really comes down to this:

If you are going 2 4870's - you must go with one of the X48 boards hdantman suggested.

If you are going with 1 GTX 280 and will not ever buy another one for SLI, then you can choose either mobo.

If you are going with 1 GTX (or 2) or plan on getting a second one at some point later - you must go with 750i or 790i. As hdantman has said, 790i will overclock better and have more features, and the price will rise accordingly.